NOTE: I never assess value of machines, so please don't phone or email me. I like to share information about my hobby through my internet homepage, but I am unable to help individuals with assessing value.

What is the Value of My Machine?
Best Price Guide
General Tips
Reasons to Invest Mostly in Edison and Victor Machines
Victor Machines--Outside Horn Machines Made By The Victor Talking Machine Company
Victrolas--Made by the Victor Talking Machine Company
Crash course on some Victor machines
Edison Machines
Brunswick Machines
Columbia Machines
Additional Materials
Concluding Thoughts

What is the Value of My Machine?

Antique Phonographs, Photos Gramophones, Victrolas, Photos & Information, Victor, Brunswick, Pathe, Columbia, Berliner, Victrola and other brands Find this Pin and more on For the Home by Julie North Adams.

'What is the value of my machine?' is the question Iget most often. It would be wonderful if I could reply withsomething short such as, 'Your Victrola XI is worth$600' or 'Your Brunswick upright model is worth$450.' But truthful answers are not this simple! Differentsellers get different prices because they sell in different ways.

Determining values for machines is not easy. People write tome asking this question: 'I just paid $400 for a Victrola XIin very nice condition--how much is it worth?' It seems tobe worth $400! I suppose they are hoping I'll reply, 'Wow,you paid $400 for a machine that is really worth $700!' Butvalue does not work that way. I have paid as little as $300 for aVictrola XI (there is a hidden price for bargains--you have towork hard to be in the right place at the right time). Meanwhile,some dealers get as much as $800 or more when selling a VictrolaXI. Dealers have contacts and methods for getting a machine inthe right place at the right time, with everything fixed, shiny,and ready to go. So is a Victrola XI worth $300 or $800? There isno right answer.

Everything depends on circumstances. If you want to know thevalue of your machine, you cannot worry too much about whatdealers get for the same machine. What a well-connected dealergets for a machine is not what you can get selling the samemachine from your living room. Location of the machine is one ofthose 'circumstances' determining price or value. Isyour machine in your home (not many potential buyers will see itthere) or it is for sale at an antiques plaza (lots of foottraffic!)? Also, we must consider the region of the country youlive in. A machine that sells for only $500 in a rural section ofMichigan might sell for twice that amount in New York City.

I receive, via email, the familiar question of 'What ismy machine worth?' about a dozen times a day. I used toreply to questions about value back in the old days when theinternet was a novelty and I had some time. I am no longer ableto do that. However, I have written (and revised) this article,which I believe should help many people. In fact, I wrote thisarticle because I found myself saying, in email, many of the samethings over and over again. So I might as well as say everythingI know in one article!

Above is a rare instruction booklet for the
the Victor V. The correct term for the above is 'Victor
talking machine.' It has an exposed or outer horn. It is not
a Victrola! See further below for a discussion about Victrolas.

I suppose if I could give good assessments without this eatinginto my time, I could provide more assessments over the internet.But good answers are never truly simple. Giving a good answer canconsume several minutes, and I cannot spare that time. I'm prettybusy raising my two little kids, spending time with my wife,doing my best at my teaching career, researching phonographtopics that interest me, and writing articles. Most readers willunderstand!

Why does it take so long for me to answer, for a stranger, aquestion about a machine's value? First, I need to look up themachine in phonograph books on my shelves to remind myself of itshistory, to recall all of that machine's special features, toknow what type of wood was used, to know whether pot metal wasused, to remind myself how many were sold when the machine wasmarketed. Next, I would check price guides that I've bought. Imight ask a friend or two who owns the same machine how much thatperson paid (of course, if that person got a bargain, or paidvery little 30 years ago, that is not much help today). Then Iwould compose a carefully worded answer, pointing out what mightincrease or decrease the value of a particular machine.

Sadly, there is no incentive for me to give such assessments,and I never give quick estimates, or 'guess-timates,'off the top of my head since such answers are helpful to nobody.Value depends upon many variables, including condition and howyou sell it. There is no 'one' price for any machine.

The best I can do here is give some general tips, citing someranges for some machines. They are only ranges to guide'newbies.' You might get higher prices if you work hardat selling your machine (of course, you might also get luckyfinding the right buyer with no effort). Likewise, you might havetrouble selling your machine despite hard work. Suppose nobody inyour town is looking for that model, or you have no luck findingthe right buyer for some other reason?

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Best Price Guide

The best price guide to phonographs is Ray Wilenzick's booktitled Phonograph Auction Prices. Thatguide's subtitle indicates how information is organized: 'AnAlphabetical Listing of Cylinder and Disc Phonographs Sold atAuctions of Major Collections.'

It is 66 pages, regular size paper, softcover, spiral binding.This book compiles prices for thousands of machines that havesold in the last year or two, mostly by auction. These are realprices paid by real people--not prices grabbed out of thin air,as in most price guides. In the book, we sometimes see multiplelistings for a particular model--the Victrola XIV, for example,which pops up often in cities throughout America. Why differencesin prices? Because there are no clear, set prices forphonographs. Price is determined by the circumstances under whicha machine is sold. Where was it sold, how was it sold, how harddid the seller work to find a buyer willing to pay a high price?Sometimes at an auction a machine sells for a low price, perhapsbecause only one phonograph collector was at the auction. On theother hand, sometimes a machine will sell for a very high pricebecause at a busy auction several phonograph enthusiasts bidagainst each other, with auction fever driving up the price tosomething far beyond what phonograph collectors might normallypay.

One way to figure out the value of your machine is to buyWilenzick's book. Study the prices he cites, and you can figureout what your machine is worth, more or less. The postpaid priceof 'Phonograph Auction Prices--2004 edition' (it waspublished in April 2004) is $30. His email address isrwilenzick@aol.com and he will be happy to answer your questions.Feel free to mention my name and homepage.

I also admire Gilbert Pasley's 26-page Pocket Guide to AntiqueMusical Machine Values, which is sadly out of print. It makescrucial distinctions between early and late versions of any givenmodel. Like the more detailed Wilenzick book, it cites specificprices, all taken from ads and auctions, allowing reader todeduce what range is about right for any given model. For theexquisite Victrola XVI, Pasley cites the realistic figures of$1000 for an oak L-door machine (taken from a 1992 ad), $700 foranother L-door machine (this time in mahogany--an 1993 ad), andso on, with one ad for a XVI in mahogany quoted at $575. Pasleyshows--without making judgments about whether it high orlow--that someone in 1993 placed an ad to sell an Edison A-150 inmahogany for $200. That is low. Not many Edison floor models sellfor as little as $200, and I think $500-700 is more realistictoday.

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General Tips

When visiting some antiques shops, I am dismayed by high pricetags attached to cabinet phonographs made by third-ratecompanies. Some of these companies were formed after WWI during apost-war boom. Whereas many Victrolas--that is, cabinet machinesmade by the prestigious Victor Talking Machine Company--are worthseveral hundred dollars today, the same is rarely true formachines made by companies that existed for only a year or two.

I warn all buyers that if a machine's name is not one yourecognize, don't spend much on the machine, or don't expect toget much for the machine when selling it. You can get a goodprice for an oddball machine only if you sell to someone whodoesn't know what he or she is doing. The Valuphone, Wolf,portable Cirola, Vitanola, Magnola, Harponola--I can namehundreds of nondescript brands. Machines made by small companiesrarely produce great sound since big companies protected theirpatented technology. Worse, suppose something today breaks on anoff-brand machine? Spare parts are difficult to find. Anadvantage of a Victrola or Edison machine is that spare parts areavailable. So many Victrolas and Edison machines were solddecades ago that today one can buy a spare crank, tone-arm,soundbox, or other small part.

I never assess the value of machines. But if I were to assessvalue, I would inquire about condition of a phonograph and thenask if the seller needs to sell items in a hurry. If you need tosell in a hurry, you can't expect to get the best price. Is theseller in a position to find that certain someone who will pay apremium price? Do you own an antiques shop where you can displayyour machine? Are you willing to spend money on advertising?

Prices cited here are for machines in fine working order--notnecessarily mint but still handsome and with no notable flaws.All original parts should be on the machines (no modern ornewly-made parts--however, it is good if soundboxes have beenserviced in recent years by reputable dealers, with fresh gasketsin those soundboxes instead of original and now-hardened gasketsfrom the 1910s or 1920s). Prices do not include anything that isin a machine, such as original binders, extra reproducers, oildispensers, needle cutters, and catalogs.

I cannot cite meaningful prices for machines with broken orfrozen parts. Pot metal parts are especially difficult to repair,so price must sometimes be determined by how much a localmachinist will charge to make a new part.

Some collectors in recent years have paid less than the pricesthat I cite for specific machines. It is a case of being in theright place at the right time, which is half the fun ofcollecting phonographs. Likewise, some people desperate for aphonograph have paid much more than the prices I cite here.

I do not cover 'Crap-o-phones,' which are too commonthese days. These are newly-made outside-horn machines, soldusually through mail-order catalogs. Some people are so worriedabout these poorly-made reproductions that they have asked me,'What about Victrolas? Are there some 'crap-o-phone'models out there of Victor's cabinet models?' After all,that is what a Victrola is--it is a cabinet model made by theVictor Talking Machine Company as opposed to an outside-hornmodel. The answer is no. Nobody is going to the expense andtrouble of making a new UPRIGHT cabinet machine. There is toomuch wood involved. Crap-o-phones are OUTSIDE-HORN machines.

Who makes these? I don't have any names but I suppose the realanswer is someone eager to make a quick buck. It is a case ofsomeone yanking a motor from an old portable machine (usually onefound in India, where portables were made for a longer periodthan anywhere else) and making a new machine, using new andcheaply-made parts--a 'new' outside horn machine! Thesemay be OK to display in a corner of the house if you are notfussy about whether your machine is a quality item or not. Themotor will break if you play the machines often, the sound isbad, and the value of 'Crap-o-phones' (that's my namefor these--they are sold under various names) will only go downin coming years.

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Allow me to say more about terminology. A Victrola should notbe confused with machines bearing names like Brunswick, Columbia,Edison, or Sonora. 'Victrola' is always capitalizedsince it is a brand name, or a machine made by a particularcompany, the Victor Talking Machine Company. Neophytes oftenrefer to any phonograph as a Victrola, saying, 'Do you knowanything about my Brunswick Victrola?' For non-Victormachines, they should use the term'phonograph'--Brunswick phonograph, Sonora phonograph,and so on.

'Victrola' is not a generic term. Again, the genericterm for non Victor machines is 'phonograph' though'talking machine' is also good. The term'gramophone' is not good since the American industrystopped using this term by 1903 or so--the British continued touse the word, and when I hear the word 'gramophone,' Ithink of British machines.

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Reasons to Invest Mostly in Edison and Victor Machines

I believe that machines manufactured by the Victor and Edisoncompanies were the best in terms of engineering, soundreproduction, craftsmanship, beauty.

The Victor Company proudly stamped its famous Nipper oneverything it produced. When people tell me they think they havea Victrola, I ask, 'Does it have a picture of the doglistening to the horn?' An affirmative answer tells me itreally is a Victrola. To refer to a Victrola as an RCA product isusually a mistake since RCA did not acquire the Victor TalkingMachine Company until 1929, after the heyday of crankphonographs.

Columbia and Brunswick sold a few fine machines. But since Iwant the best, I make room in my house only for Victor talkingmachines (that's the right term for Victor's outside hornmachines) and Victrolas (the right term for the Victor company'scabinet models, those machines with built-in horns, usuallyhidden behind doors).

I also make room for Edison cylinder and disc machines. AnEdison disc machine plays only thick Edison discs (called DiamondDiscs) though decades ago you could buy attachments to playnon-Edison 78s (Victor and Columbia discs are called lateral cutrecords) on Edison disc phonographs.

I recommend Victor and Edison machines over all others partlybecause parts are available. Suppose a spring breaks, or areproducer is cracked, or a crank is missing. The Victor TalkingMachine Company and Edison company standardized so many parts andsold so many units that another spring, reproducer, or crank canbe found with relative ease. Finding spare or extra parts formachines built by Columbia or Brunswick is difficult since not somany machines sold. I won't list the third-rate companies thatsold machines in even smaller quantities. Finding extra parts forthese brands or for machines made in Europe is often impossible.

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Victor Machines--Outside Horn Machines Made By The VictorTalking Machine Company

These machines are among the most sought after. They start at$1000 and go up, up, up. When people ask me where they can buyoutside horn machines, I first say 'I wish I knew!' andthen give the advice that they should settle for a cabinetmachine. You won't bring home a vintage horn machine with alloriginal parts unless you are rich or extremely lucky. As Iwarned earlier, avoid those new-looking horn machines soldthrough mail order catalogs, some of which end up in shops. Theseare hastily assembled outside of the United States from verycheap parts.

Above is a Victor machine (visual was taken
from a Victor V instruction booklet). This
machine is not a Victrola! A Victor machine
has an exposed horn whereas a Victrola has
an internal (hidden) horn.

Why is a phonograph with an outside horn harder to find than acabinet model? Because relatively few were made, and everyonewants one. More cabinet models were sold (supply is relativelyhigh), yet today demand is much higher for outside horn machines.Most people who love antiques prefer horn machines because theyfeel these evoke the past more than cabinet models.

From 1901 to 1920, Victor marketed about 20 outside hornmachine models. That may seem like many models, but most weremade in the first decade of the twentieth century, when Victorwas a new company, and sales were relatively modest (the industrywas roaring soon after the cabinet models were introduced). Thebest selling exposed horn model was the Victor II, with about125,000 selling. A greater number of cabinet models wereintroduced, several of which sold in excess of 200,000.

The outside-horn models include the A, B, C, D, Monarch, P,Royal, I, II, III, IV, V, VI (this is the most prized today,worth about $5,000), and the XXV (the odd and rare'Schoolhouse Victor').

Cabinet machines were introduced because many people long agobelieved horn machines were clumsy and ugly. The upper classeswho bought most machines resented how dust collected on horns andcomplained that the machines were eyesores. Manufacturerslistened. Sales of outside horn machines plummeted when cabinetmodels were introduced, but horn machines did not disappear. Thesmall Victor Junior stayed in production until 1920. As Victor'slowest priced spring-driven machine, it originally sold for $10.It is worth over $1000 today.

Many of Victor's outside-horn machines will deliver a bettersound than Victor's earliest cabinet model since the latter'sbuilt-in horn was small despite a whopping $200 price tag. But by1910, cabinets held bigger horns--that meant a bigger sound. A1905 record will sound as good when played on a 1905 outside-hornmachine (in excellent condition) as on any machine made at anyother time.

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Victrolas--Made by the Victor Talking Machine Company

A Victrola is a machine with a built-in horn (hidden, notexposed as with early machines) made by the Victor company.Terminology is important. Outside horn machines made by theVictor company (the early ones that everyone wants!) should becalled a Victor talking machines. Later models with built-inhorns are Victrolas. No machine made by a rival company, such asColumbia, Brunswick or Sonora, should be called a Victrola!

Among Victrolas, there are portables, table-top models, and(perhaps most common) full uprights. If you see a 'VV'on a metal place before a number, that means 'VictorVictrola.' For example, a plate might say VV-XI. That meansVictor Victrola XI (that's the Roman number for '11' oreleven').

Before 1921, the company used Roman numerals for Victrolas.These are the IV (table-top), VI (table-top), VIII (table-top),IX (table-top), X (table-top and upright), XI (table-top andupright, with the upright version being very common), XII (thehighest Roman number to come as a table-top), XIV(upright--again, all numbers above XII are uprights), XVI, XVII,XVIII, and XX. The last three--what I call the 17, 18, and20--are quite rare and sell for over a thousand dollars today.

If your machine has on the metal identification place a Romannumber for the model (e.g., 'II') as opposed to aregular Arabic number ('2'), it was made before 1921.On this plate you'll find the machine's serial number.

The portable machine above is a Victrola
50. The '-ola' was used by the company
for models with interior or hidden horns.

Two simple table-top Victrola models are the IV and VI . TheIV and VI sold from late 1911 to 1926, when the Orthophonicmodels finally made these 'acoustic' machines outdated.The IV and VI are fairly common since they were the mostaffordable Victrolas, with the IV originally priced at $15 andthe VI priced at $25. They were inexpensive! Consider that mostrecords were a dollar each, and that many Caruso records sold for$3 each. Each model went up ten dollars in price during aninflationary period, so the IV ended up at $25 and the VI at $35.

The VI was a little more expensive since it has a doublespring motor, not a single spring. Also, it is slightly larger.

Roughly the same number of IV and VI models were sold--thatis, you are as likely to come across a IV as a VI. In the 1980s,I paid as little as $100 for these machines, but the days offinding such machines at garage sales are over, it seems. The IVtoday is worth about $200 to $250, and the VI is worth about $250to 300. Look for the original Exhibition sound box on eachmachine. If your IV or VI has a No. 2 sound box or any other kindof sound box, then someone made a replacement at some point. AVictor sound box in good condition (recently replaced gaskets, nomica problems) is worth about $50 to $60.

Again, 'Victrola' means Victor machines withinternal or hidden horns. There is no VV-V, or Victor Victrola 5,though there is a Victor V, which of course is an outside hornVictor talking machine, not a Victrola. Do not confuse theVictrola VI (a simple table-top model) with the Victor VI (agrand outside horn machine worth ten times as much).

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Crash course on some Victor machines

V-V on the Victrola plate means 'VictorVictrola' (or inside horn machine).

V-V IV is a common table top model, selling from 1911to 1926.

V-V VI is also fairly common, selling in those sameyears but at a higher price than the IV.

V-V X comes as a table top model and as an upright,selling from 1910 to 1921.

V-V XI is the most common Victrola, with over 853,000sold from 1910 to 1921 (then it was renamed the V-V 90, with amodest 85, 405 units sold from 1921 to 1924--the'console' style had usurped the 'upright'style by this time).

V-V XII = rare (only 4,913 units sold)

V-V XIII = rare (only 662 units sold--I've never seenone!)

V-V XIV sold well from 1910 to 1921, when it wasrenamed the 110.

V-V XVI sold well from 1910 to 1921, when it wasrenamed the 120.

Brunswick Panatrope Phonograph For Sale

V-V 210 is a console model that sold from 1923 to 1925at $100. It sold better than other console models, with 197,000units selling in the two years it was on the market. It metpopular demand for a 'flat top' console unit--it soldbetter than the earlier console models introduced by the company,which were flawed by having protruding lids instead of flat tops.

V-V 215 is a console that sold from 1923 to 1925 at$150 (this and similar console models no longer sold after 1925due to the introduction of the new 'Orthophonic' linethat played electrically recorded discs).

V-V 220 is another console model. It sold from $200 to$240, so it was relatively expensive in the console line thoughnot as pricey as the 230.

V-V240 is a so-called 'humpback model, as are the260, 280, 300, and 330. They are called 'humpback'models by collectors (not by original Victor dealers) due to theraised lid that prevent anyone from placing vases or otherobjects on the console. It was not a flat top, but consumersactually wanted flat tops, so the company introduced flat topconsoles to meet demand.

VICTROLA XI

The Victrola XI (that's the Roman number
for '11') is the easiest to find among
Victrolas since it sold very well from 1910 to 1921,
when it was finally renamed the Victrola 90. Nearly
900,000 units of the Victrola XI were sold!

The Victrola XI was the most popular or best-selling Victrola.It sold well because its price was 'just right' for somany Americans--$100 when introduced in late 1912 though theprice went up as the economy changed, with inflation raisingprice to $130 by 1921. In 1917 the letter 'A' was added('XI-A') though the company stopped using this'A' within a year or so. The XI was renamed the No. 90in 1921. Price today is $400-700. Also popular and similar indesign was the Victrola X (the 'X-A' in 1917), renamedthe Victrola No. 80 in 1921. Price today is $350-$650. TheVictrola X is a little less desirable than the XI.

The Victrola XIV also sold well decades ago. It was renamedNo. 110 in 1921. Price is $500-800. It matters little in pricewhether a XIV is an early one from 1910 to 1914; a mid-period one(for example, the Type E of 1915-1917); or the so-called'modified' XIV introduced in April 1917, which featuresthe fat tonearm, the 4-spring motor (not 3-spring), the lower andlighter lid, the thinner doors

Console models--four legs, wide instead of tall--were popularin 1923 and 1924. These include the 210, 215, 220, 230, 240, 260,280, 300, and 330 (the last five are so-called'humpback' models due to the traditional Victor lidsthat stick up). These console models are not as impressive asuprights. They were fashionable in 1923 and 1924, then went outof fashion. The horn is a little too low, too close to the floor,to satisfy those with discerning ears. Many Victrola collectorsare a little snobbish when it comes to these consoles, refusingto make room for them in the house. In any case, few today sellfor as much as uprights. Price is usually $400-700.

Orthophonic models--a whole new line of Victrolas, designed toplay new electrically recorded discs--were introduced in November1925. The Credenza held a very large horn and delivered Victor'sbest sound ever. These models are worth about $1500 today. Seethe article about Credenzas on my homepage.

Edison Standard Phonograph Serial Numbers

VICTROLA XVI

Among knowledgeable collectors, high prices are paid for theVictrola XVIs models, up to and including the Model H.

XVIs began with doors shaped like L's, which were made fromAugust 1907 until September 1912. One or two price guides outthere may refer to these earliest models as 'L-doorXVIs,' but the ideal price guide would make more subtledistinctions, citing letters.

The early models are the A and the larger-sized B, which areVTLA-like models featuring raised motorboards (notice that the Bhad two blued wood screws under the turntable--that would changewith subsequent models), and the C and D, which are similarexcept the C has the old style on-off switch (which also acts asa bullet brake) whereas the D has the later style on-off switchmoved to the 7 o'clock position--moreover, the D has four goldscrews instead of the C's four blued wood screws. L-door modelshave drawers that are ideal for holding supplements and needletins. I am sorry that Victor's engineers eliminated thesepull-out boards when redesigning the XVI.

Higher prices are also paid for the rare E, which was thefirst of the newly designed XVIs, with doors no longer L-shapedand with the on-off switch at the 1 o'clock position (at theback) instead of at 7 o'clock (towards the front); for the rare F(the winder is thicker and longer than on earlier models) and G,both of which have a speed regular at the back instead of in thefront like the E. (Speed pointers on the F and G are unenclosed,which turned out to be a design flaw since they can catch onsomeone's sleeve--eisenglass was subsequently used for speedpointers.)

Finally, higher prices should be paid for the XVI model H,which was made between late 1914 and late 1917. The H isdifferent from preceding models in various ways--the winding keyis put back in the middle instead of being forward as in the E,F, and G; all parts are gold-plated (the turntable platter isnickel on the A-G); the cabinet's back cornerposts are carved;the motor can be raised and suspended on hinges that allow foreasy maintenance.

No XVIs are common but the later XVIs with fat tone-arms fetchslightly lower prices since they are more available than earlierXVIs. Victor stopped using letters after the H model, socollectors refer to such models as fat-arm XVIs (a few of thesehave an 'A' on the identification plate). Also, lowerprices should be paid for the Victrola 120, which is the XVIgiven an Arabic number beginning in 1921. A cabinet machine madefrom a rare wood, such as Circassian Walnut, is obviously in ahigher price range than machines made from more typical woods.

PORTABLES--SUITCASE MODELS

Machine manufacturers offered small machines to meet thedemand in the 1920s for portables. The demand rose as prosperityspread and more automobiles took people to picnics, beaches, andthe countryside.

Above is Victrola's 2-55, worth around
$250-300 today. Original price in the late
1920s was $35. It was introduced to dealers
in The Voice of the Victor in April 1928. The
design includes the unusual 'angle-wind,' which
means the winding key (or crank) is at an odd angle.

Victor's suitcase-like portables, which weigh about 17 pounds,are cute, well-designed, and easy to restore. The built-in hornis small but adequate for playing 78s of small jazz bands orukulele artists. If you take a portable to your next picnic, Irecommend a Nick Lucas record such as 'Tip Toe Thru' TheTulips'--fine crooning accompanied by solo guitar.

The first machine I owned was a portable. In 1986, I paid $100for an offbrand called Academy. The sound was bad, and when apot-metal device broke, I could not replace the part. I sold thebroken machine for $8 and swore that, for portables, I would onlybuy Victors, which can be found for around $100 in sad shape to$200 in good condition. I now own over a dozen. If you have achance to buy one at a low price, glue the broken seams, rub shoepolish into the vinyl-like exteriors, oil a few dry motorparts--these portable machines made by the Victor Talking MachineCompany deserve a second life.

From 1921 to 1929, eight Victor portable models wereintroduced: the 35, 50, 1-5, 1-6,2-30, 2-35, 2-55, and 2-60. The50, which sold from 1921 to 1925 (it was Victor's first portable,not the 35), is the most collectible model due to its exquisitewood exterior--mahogany or oak. Other models have fabric orvinyl-like exteriors (it reminds me of vinyl though I don't thinkvinyl was around as early as this).

I recently saw a modified No. 50 machine in a shop inPetaluma, California. Someone had slapped a bright red paint overthe oak exterior. My wife, knowing how upset I get upon finding amachine irretrievably ruined, carries smelling salts for suchoccasions. It doesn't matter that it is a small machine. A pieceof our heritage is lost.

The cutest non-suitcase portable machines is the Cameraphone,which is the size of a 1920s box-shaped Kodak. I also like theMikiphone. Sound quality is bad but collectors want them fordisplay, not listening. They sell for around $400-500.

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EDISON MACHINES

I'll discuss some Edison cylinder machines, then discmachines.

A) Edison Cylinder Machines

One nice Edison cylinder machine is the Gem, which is smalland lacks power. Call it the baby of Edison phonographs. It has akey-wound spring motor that is supposed to play a two-minutecylinder at a full winding, but I find that most Gem motors winddown before a cylinder is over (they had more power decades ago).A Gem sold in 1908 for about $12.50. More powerful models werepriced higher. Today, a simple 'black' Gem is worthabout $600-700, maybe as much as $900 if in great condition. Thelast Gems made were the so-called 'red' Gems (finishedin red enamel). They are worth more than the more common'black' Gems because fewer of the red ones were made,and I think the springs are more powerful.

The Fireside model A was successful when introduced in 1909.It came with a 19 inch straight horn though a two-piece'cygnet' horn came with the later model B.'Cygnet' is French for swan, and the horn is elegant.This model could play 'standard' records--that is, twominute cylinders--and four minute ones. Some people are surprisedwhen they learn that cylinders came in either a two or fourminute format and that each format requires the right equipment.I feel two minutes is too short for a song but four minutes canget tedious. Most Victor discs of popular tunes (issued on blacklabel, not the famous Red Seal label, which was for classical)play for about 3 minutes, which I feel is just right.

In June 2000, I saw an advertisement for an Edison Operamachine with original wood horn, a record cabinet, and 92 BlueAmberol cylinders. The seller stated rather vaguely in the ad,'All in good shape.' Price was $6,500. It sold rightaway. So that may mean an Edison Opera with original horn, and afew 'extras,' is worth $6,500? Or is the package worthmore? Given the fact that it sold quickly, I guess $7,000 is the'right' price these days. I have an Opera but it lacksthe original wood horn. Does anyone has such a horn for sale?

Many machines have the name Amberola, which Edison producedfrom 1909 to 1929 in various models. These have internal hornsinstead of exposed ones. The Victor company had great successwith its built-in horn models--that is, Victrolas--and Edisontried to compete.

The splendid Amberola IA was marketed from 1909 to 1912 andplayed two- and four- minute cylinders. Both the A and B (thelatter was introduced in 1912) were costly, selling from $200(for mahogany or oak) to $250 (for walnut). The A was for 2minute and 4 minute cylinders whereas the 1B was strictly for 4minute items

There was no Amberola II. The Amberola III sold from 1912 to1915. The Amberola IV is rare (around 150 were built) whereas theAmberola V table model is fairly common today since it sold verywell. The Amberola VI came in three forms. Soon came the VIII andX. No VII or IX appeared.

These numbers get confusing, and in 1915 Edison consolidatedthe Amberolas into three lines named for the dollars needed tobuy one: the 30 sold for $30, the 50 for $50, and the 75 for $75.The 30 and 50 were table models, the 75 a floor model. The model30 pops up more than the other two.

Today, the Amberola 30 is worth $400-500, the Amberola 50 is$500-600, and the 75 is $600-800.

Above is Edison's 'Opera' model--one of the most desired of all machines!

B) Edison Disc Machines

Edison Diamond Disc records are thick because Edison needed aflat surface for the diamond stylus installed on a horizontalsound box to play them. Edison used an unusual diaphragmmade of seven layers of rice paper impregnated withshellac. The rice paper used was not the rice paper madefrom edible rice, but from the rice paper plant, Tetrapanaxpapyriferum, a member of the Ginseng plant family.

Thisrice paper contains strong fibers (in Edison's day the modernmacromolecule plastics were not yet available). The thick EdisonDiamond discs are not made of shellac, as the old 78 rpm recordswere, but have surfaces made of Bakelite, an earlythermoplastic. The grooves on these records are narrowly'U' shaped and require a precision ground diamondstylus mounted into a metal shank to play them. A steelneedle would ruin these Edison discs because the recording is onthe bottoms of the grooves (vertical-cut method), not the sides(lateral-cut method), as is the case for regular 78 rpm shellacrecords. Edison discs have 150 grooves per inch. Gearing from the internal spring motor advances the internal ironhorn, tone arm, and sound box, across the records, a uniqueEdison feature. In other words, it was not necessary for therecord grooves to move the stylus and tone arm forward. Edison discs are meant to be played at 80 rpm.

Edison made several dozen models including upright floormodels, low console floor models, table models, and evenexpensive art case models.

Let's consider the Edison S-19 as a typical machine--not thebest, not the cheapest. The S means 'Sheraton.'It is a half-cabinet upright. A half-cabinet does not storeas many records as the full cabinet models. The S-19 wasintroduced in the spring of 1919, when all phonographs wereselling like hotcakes since the war was over, rationing was over,and Americans, who had saved money in 1918 (not much wasavailable to spend money on, due to rationing), had plenty tospend on luxury items like phonographs. It has a singlespring, so it was not top of the line, but it was a decentmachine, like all mid-line Edison products. Original pricewas $195 but that jumped to $200 in December 1919 (a hot economyoften leads to this kind of inflation). In 1922,phonographs were no longer selling, and the S-19 was priceddownwards to $150, and it seems the model was discontinued by1923. Value today is about $500-600.

The Model C250 (later C19) Edison Diamond Disc Phonographs arereferred to as the Chippendale style cabinet, based on designs ofthe famous 18th century English furniture maker (the grillepattern was styled after French Gothic arches). The cabinetis a tall upright floor model. It proved to be one of Edison'smost popular models. The C250 was introduced inDecember of 1915 as the official Edison Laboratory Model. Only models with a double spring motor and the largest size (No.250) of internal horn qualified as official laboratorymodels. Cabinets were available in red mahogany, Englishbrown mahogany, golden oak, fumed oak, or walnut. The exposedmetal parts were gold plated; a 12-inch turntable was standard.The initial price for the Chippendale phonographs was $250, aconsiderable sum at that time, but the price gradually rose to$285.00 due to shortages created during World War I.

In April of 1919 the C-250's designation was changed to C-19.The C-19 models were available until 1927 when the firstelectrically recorded Edison records were released and specialEdisonic phonographs were produced to play them. In1922 Edison began the manufacture of a low, wide consoleversion of the Chippendale cabinet phonograph, the Model CC32.

Value today for these fine machines is about $800-1200.

On June 14, 2000, my good friend Ron Dethlefson--the Edisonexpert--helped me restore the mechanism of my Diamond Disc model200. Why did the Edison Company call it a model 200? Becauseoriginal price, when the model was introduced in 1912, was $200.That was the A-200, made from 1912 through 1915. The B-200 wasintroduced after the factory fire of December 1914, and thismodel was available until the fall of 1915. Mine is a C-200 (withmodel B motor), probably from 1918 since the serial number is18775 (that is a high number, and the C-200 was discontinued by1919, which is why I deduce mine is from around 1918). Thecabinet is the Sheraton. The C-200 was succeeded by the S-19. Thecompany did not like to continue using names like '150'(for machines that sold at $150) and '200' (for $200machines) and '250' (for lab models selling at $250)since prices had to be raised during the war. It was no longerpractical to call a machine a '200' when it no longersold for $200.

The 200 model is fairly rare because it competed against the$150 model and the $250. Most folks chose either the 150 model or250 model, not the one in between. If you had to watch yourbudget, you chose the 150. If you could afford the bettermachine, you got the 250 since you got two springs (instead ofone) and a larger horn, which was worth the extra money. The 200model is fairly simple.

My C-200 has all original parts, and we have oiled all theright places, cleaned the inside horn with 'turtle' carwax, spray-painted parts of the horn that were no longer black,sealed a few tiny holes in the horn (we don't want air to leakfrom the horn and thus lose volume--instead we want a sealed orairtight horn). The value of the machine today, we feel, isbetween $500 and $700.

A model 150 might be worth $350 to $600. A top-of-the-linelaboratory model might go from $700 to $1200, but I shouldsomeday give more detailed information about these fine models,some of which originally sold for up to $6,000! So when I givethe range of $700 to $1200, I am not including the Edison Artmodels that once sold for thousands! Edison made a few machinesthat sold for higher amounts than those by any other maker.

The Edison 'LP' (long-playing) disc machines do popup once in a great while. These console or 'low boy'machines were made in 1926, lasting only a year on the market. Itwas Edison's attempt to introduce a long-playing record system.The company wanted something new to compete against radio andalso the other companies' switch to electrical recording. But theexperiment failed because the records, with 400 grooves to theinch, were too fragile to stand up to daily use. Also, one had todo a lot of winding to get the 36 foot long motor springs readyto play for 20 minutes for 10-inch discs and 40 minutes for12-inch discs! These records, which played at 80 rpm, wore outtoo quickly and were too faint in volume, compared to Victor orColumbia records of the day, not to mention radio. Today, Edison10- and 12-inch 'LP' records sell for around $300 eachif in pristine condition . The machines today range from $1500 to$2000. Remember, the machines must come equipped with the rarelong-play reproducers. The words 'long play' werestamped onto each reproducer.

The Edison portable Model P-1 from 1929 (it played only'lateral cut' discs, or needle-type--not DiamondDiscs!) is worth about $300-400. It was originally priced at $35.

A range of $800-1200 is about right for the two Edisonicmodels--the Beethoven and Schubert models, which are late Edisondisc machines, designed to play the now-rare electricallyrecorded Diamond Discs. In the popular series, these carrynumbers above 52088, with 52088 being the last'acoustic' Diamond Disc

Edison expert Ron Dethlefson has, for sale, a reprint of theEdison Disc Motor Manual, which was published in 1920 for use byEdison repairmen. It is roughly 20 pages with many illustrationson how to do repairs properly and bring your machines back tooriginal factory specifications. For a postpaid copy, send $5 toRon Dethlefson, 3605 Christmas Tree Lane, Bakersfield CA 93306.It contains information that is available nowhere else. Itillustrates how to repair and tune-up your Edison disc machine.Ron has also included information about the operation of theearly model A Diamond Disc machines, produced from 1912 to 1915,which have different mechanisms than most Diamond Disc machinesfound today.

How do you know if your Edison machine has been'monkeyed' with in past decades by past owners? Forfun, I like to figure out, after adding an Edison disc machine tomy collection, if anyone has removed the motor board, or'bedplate,' since the time the machine left the Edisonfactory. One thing I look for in disc machines (as opposed tocylinder) is the felt that was originally placed under the nutsthat you remove in order to take the motor board out. The felt isgone? That means someone was in there and failed to replace thefelt. That is a shame since it means metal is rattling againstmetal. The felt was put there by factory workers for a reason. Ordoes the felt look new? When I recently worked on my C-200, Idiscovered the old, original felt. I think nobody had lifted outthe motor board since the time it was put together in the factoryaround 1918.

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BRUNSWICK Machines

Brunswick machines are not as valued as Victrolas. They havewell-designed motors, but the soundboxes and tone-arms are notimpressive (an exception may be made for the remarkable Ultonareproducer).

A Brunswick table model might go for $200-350whereas a Brunswick upright might go for $300-500. I confess Idon't make room in my own home for Brunswick machines though Iwould make an exception for the superb Panatrope, which wasintroduced in 1926. Today, a Panatrope might sell for $1000.

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COLUMBIA Machines

Columbia horn machines are not as well-built as Victor hornmachines, but all horn machines are in demand, so Columbia hornmachines start at $1000. Columbia Grafonola floor models (thereare too many to list here) are not as good as Victor models ofthe same size. The use of pot-metal, some relatively noisymotors, the straight-tube tone arms (in contrast to Victor'stapered arms)--Columbia quality rarely matches that of Victor. Iknow of no Columbia machines made from 1913 to 1925 that deliveras rich a sound as Edison Diamond Disc machines. Value today forthe floor models is about $300-500.

Columbia employed a confusing array of names and numbers forits models. I suspect Columbia changed numbers at times forreasons meaningful only to the company, not the buying public.Adding to the confusion is the fact that when Columbia for ashort period used model numbers that indicated the dollars neededto buy a phonograph (two examples are the No. 75 and No. 85,which cost $75 and $85, respectively--they are the same exceptthe higher number has an electric motor), the company soon hadthe same phonograph with several different names.

I do not own Columbia machines but I would not mind creatingsome new space in my house for one of the three Viva-Tonal modelsintroduced in late 1927: the Portable Model 160 ($50); the Model602 ($90), and Model 711 ($175). Nor would I mind owning theModel 950, a combination of the Kolster Radio Receiving Set withan 'electric phonograph.' Introduced in early 1929 at$450, it is housed in a writing cabinet and is like no othermodel.

Perhaps this is the place for me to share observations aboutColumbia's use of 'phonograph' as a word. I studyadvertisements for how 'phonograph' and 'talkingmachine' are used and notice that Columbia literature fromthe turn of the century to about 1923 proudly called machines'Graphophones' or 'Grafonolas,' and almostnothing else. For example, a full-page advertisement in theSeptember 15, 1910, issue of Youth's Companion has much textpraising Grafonola models--the Regent, De Luxe, Mignon,Elite--but 'phonograph' is not used except once inquote marks ('If you are prejudiced against all'phonographs,' please admit that you have not heard a 1910Columbia Graphophone'), with the quote marks used to raise aquestion about the word's legitimacy. The text does refer to'talking machines,' even claiming that Columbia was'Creators of the Talking Machine Industry'! In1919-1920, when the Sheraton model was advertised in countlessads, the word 'phonograph' is never used, at least notin two dozen ads that I recently examined.

In Columbia advertising during the first couple of decades ofthis century, the word 'phonograph' is generallyavoided although the word was used prior to 1913 whenever thecompany is named. After all, the marketing arm of the AmericanGraphophone Company was The Columbia Phonograph Company, General.Having the word 'phonograph' in the formal name wasevidently an irritant to Columbia executives, who changed it tothe Columbia Graphophone Company in January 1913. The name waschanged back to the Columbia Phonograph Company around the time'New Process' records were introduced in October 1923and around the time a new trademark--the one word'Columbia' sitting above tied musical notes--wasadopted. Why the name change to the Columbia Phonograph Company?Creditors took over after owners of Columbia shares, allegingthat the company was insolvent, applied for a receivership onFebruary 9, 1922. Perhaps this led to the name change though I donot know how. After the British firm Columbia GraphophoneCompany, Ltd., headed by Louis Sterling, took over the Americancompany in early 1925, 'phonograph' was used fairlyoften in Columbia ads.

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Additional Materials

'A Big Book AboutPhonographs' is a history of Victolasand other vintage machines--do a search on the internet and maybeyou'll find a copy for sale. It is over 230 pages, spiralbinding, unique! Subtitled 'Original Articles & RareTalking Machine Advertisements.'

It compiles newly-writtenarticles from experts (R. J. Wakeman, Ron Pendergraft, DavidSpanovich and others who had contributed regularly to Victrolaand 78 Journal) and rare visuals from elusive trade journalssuch as Talking Machine World as well as Voice ofthe Victor, which was the house organ of the Victor TalkingMachine Company.

Articles cover Victor's Orthophonic machines('Victor's Orthophonic Credenza--the King ofMachines?'), the portable (or suitcase-like) machines thatwere made by various companies from 1921 to 1926 ('A Historyof America's Portable Talking Machines'), the differenttypes of phonograph needles (steel, Tungs-tone, fibre, cactus),how to restore Victrola cabinets (good discussion of HOW to applylemon oil to make a cabinet shine again), off-brand phonographsintroduced from 1917 through 1922 (nice illustrations!), muchmore. Articles from The Voice of the Victor include 'The NewVictrola XVII' (December 1916). Information aboutreproducers (Victor called them 'sound boxes').

You'll learn about machines made by Victor, Columbia, Edison, Brunswick,Cheney, Artophone, Trumpetone Company (soundbox looks like atrumpet!), Sonora, Cathedral Phonograph, Swanson PortablePhonograph, Peter Pan, Claxtonola, the Lampograph Company(machines made like lamps!), Magnola, Pathe, Bluebird TalkingMachine Company, National Talking Machine Company, Charmaphone,Fulton Talking Machine Company (maker of the Maestrola),Aeolian-Vocalion, Buehn Phonograph Company (this was mainly anEdison distributor), Plaza Music Company (learn about thecamera-size 'Kompact'!), Hiawatha Phonograph Company(Chicago firm), Player-Tone Talking Machine Company, Modernola,Kodisk ('Snapshots of Your Voice'--early homerecordings, with Irving Kaufman featured in advertisements!),Consolidated Talking Machine Company. Many Victrola guides areduplicated, too--for example, manual for the Victrola 50,'Instructions for Unpacking a Victrola 215,'Instructions How To Opeate the Victor Fibre NeedleCutter,' 'Instructions for the Operation of the VictorAutomatic Brake.' Sonora literature, Cheney literature,early Edison cylinder and disc machines, etc. This is a bookabout MACHINES (not about records or artists).

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Concluding Thoughts

When friends visit me, they marvel that my home has a Victrolain every corner. I collect these wonderful machines partlybecause they are so attractive but primarily because they deliverthe best sound when I play 78s. An Enrico Caruso record played onhigh-fidelity equipment can sound good, but I get a warmer tonefrom the same record played on a vintage machine.

'Instructions for Repairing theVictor Motors and Exhibition Sound Box' (with wonderfulvisuals as well as informative text!)!

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As mentioned, Pathe began business as an agent, importing and selling Phonographs & Graphophones. Their 1898 cartalog still shows the Edison & Graphophone products that they were selling. It must have occurred to the Pathe brothers, as the import business flourished, that there was more money to be made in actually manufacturing their own line of machines. The Pathe Graphophone is mechanically a direct copy of a Graphophone AT though with a Pathe made case. It would appear that the motor was a Graphophone AT motor, while the upper works were cast in an inferior pot-metal, that in most of these models that have survived, the upper works are distorted and unplayable.
More pictures to follow.

If the Pathe Graphophone, AT copy is puzzling, Pathe also sold a modified AT Graphophone adapted with the Pathe style horn guide mechanism.
Picture to follow
Thus looking at the various models that Pathe developed over theit decade of Phonograph manufacture, the influence of the Graphophone AT & Graphophone Eagle are quite evident.